zOwie Omega Discussion Forum

Which Vintage Omega would YOU re-issue ?

Posted By: SteveW62

Date:
7/18/06 11:15 GMT

Hi Guys,

Over the years Omega have released various "land-mark" watches. Some of these are still very collectable & popular.

Omega have re-issued various watches. eg their Musuem Collection out of the price range of most us "Normal" collectors), or the 1957 Speedmaster Replica, or the Speedmaster Pro Moonphase.

Here's the 1957 replica ( thanks to www.2jfk.com)

Yup, seen that. Doesn't do much for me.

Firstly, I thought the original "flat lugged" speedy would be a good one to Re-issue, but IF we went down that route, that would just open the doors for lots of Fakes & Frankens... so I skipped that one pretty quickly.

I think there are two diametrically opposed thoughts when Omega offers these Museum watches...

1. Omega wants them to be popular enough to sell, but
2. Omega doesn't want them to be so popular that they feel compelled to sell them in an on-going fashion.

Then I thought the flightmaster, but there are enough of these around.

I don't necessarily agree. Traditionally, the Flightmasters have been readily available and at very recent prices. But recently, the typically selling prices have pushed past $1,000~1,200 through the mid-teens and some of the nicer examples are seeking prices in the low $2k strada.

At these street prices, Omega could come out with a new version of the Flightmaster (either as a Museum Collection piece, a "Flightmaster II" or a new name (perhaps "Spacemaster"?) priced in the Moonwatch "Sapphire Sandwich" price niche, and also be satisfying a persistant itch to create a "Big Watch" to cash in the trend of the past 8-10 years.

A c.910 or even easier the c.911 wouldn't be that difficult for Omega to get Lemania (Montrose Bruget) to make up a batch of them for sale. A few tweaks to make sure that Collectors won't be angry and it's a done deal.

Actually, while I am not certain this would be my first choice, it is my highest realistic choice for Omega. If the Museum offering is popular then they can consider making it a semi-permenent member of the product line, if not, it'll be replaced with a new Museum watch in a year or so anyway.

The PloProf ?... na too extreme.

Agreed... Too much too late. It's like wearing a full face Motor Race Helmet just to go down to the corner for a gallon of milk. It's overkill in the extreme.

After some thought, I came up with the Speedmaster 1045 Moon Case.

This is a watch that was issued in the mid eighties, in limited quantities & still commands VERY high prices ( you'll be lucky to find one under $3500 ).

One would have to consider oneself lucky to be able to land one at all, and very lucky at even the $4k price point.

It has ALL the advantages (optics) of the classic Speedmaster Professional, but is also an Automatic, with Day & Date powered by the Lemania 5100 - Omega 1045 movement .

I'm sure this would sell. It has everything going for it. The only minor change I'd suggest is to use black day/date wheels with white writing on them.

Agreed on all of the points above. Of course, one would have to substitute Super Lumova for Tritium (not a big deal) and Omega would probably not bring back the outstanding 1450 bracelet, but rather substitute the excellent current moonwatch bracelet. The day-date wheel color would be the main thing I'd change. I'm not sure if I'd lose the white border around those aperatures or not. I could go either way.

Here is Chuck Maddox watch ( Chuck's pic .... tee hee - don't tell him ! )

That's a picture of a watch I own, It's become known as the Grail (my fault) but I wouldn't call it "the Chuck Maddox Speedmaster"... Call it the Grail and most people will know what you mean.

I have absolutely no problems with anyone using my photo's in this manner... To educate or promote discussion. Where it's used for commerical purposes or in a misrepresenting manner I'd have a problem. But you're fine Steve.

But here is a more current and better picture.

So what would you choice be ? & why ?

Here is the problem with the 376.0822... It's movement... The Lemania 5100/Omega c.1045. Swatch Group has been, frankly just stupid about it's attitude towards this movement. If they aren't interested in using it, produce it for those firms who are interested in using it and make money off it, If you're not interested in making them for profit, sell it to someone (your choice: Sinn, Bell & Ross, Fortis, Tutima, Revue Thommen, LVMH) who is interested in being able to continue to make watches with this movement and they can make money selling the movement to other's if they wish. Or form a new company or consortium to make this movement.

But no. Swatch Group would rather snuff it out.

As much as it pains me to say this, I doubt that Swatch Group will come to it's senses and do any of the possible "right things" for the movement, it's customers or the Swiss Watch Industry.

I've said for several years (and even offered a wager to Omega on the topic) that Omega could offer a new 376.0822 along side of their choice of c.33xx movement and not only would the 376.0822 outsell the c.33xx counterpart it would also have a better reliability and durability record. I've even offered to stake every last Omega in my collection vs. a like value of watches in their collections as a wager. And before anyone asks, it's a serious and sober offer which I doubt Omega would ever seriously consider. They know it'd be a losing thing to wager against the 5100/1045.

If I were in charge of Omega I'd press for the 5100 to make it happen. Yes, it would be my first choice (narrowly beating out a Flightmaster). But I don't know if Omega could get Hayek and Swatch Group to run them off a batch of 5100's. I tend to think no. But if I were in charge of Omega I'd press for that.

If I were in charge of Swatch, I'd clean house of all of those involved in the discontinuation of the 5100. It's a movement that could have as strong of legs as the Valjoux(/ETA) 7750 has if it wasn't sabotaged by Swatch mismanagement. If it made no sense for Swatch to keep manufacturing it I'd offer to sell it to a consortium of watch firms interested in buying the rights, tooling and spares. Those firms (mainly the one's I IDed above) are going to compete against Omega, Hamilton, etc. regardless using Valjoux(/ETA) 7750's or ETA/Dubois-Depraz chronographs anyway, why not make money off them by selling them a more expensive movement if they are willing, or make some money off the tooling that will just sit and deteriorate if left in storage.

And if the Revolution comes, as Bas VanDorp so elegantly put it, those responsible for the mismanagement of the 5100 would be the first against the wall!

A PiePan Connie ? A rare Seamaster ? A quartz re-issue ( don't laugh, some Quartz watches are now almost 30 years old !

Would you change it any way ?

My personal first choice (if I could get the movements -- which is not a given) would be a current version of the Grail 376.0822 with Superlumova (because you can't use Tritium these days), White on Black Day-Date Wheels, and if I couldn't bring back the 1450, I'd substitute the current Moonwatch bracelet as the best modern choice, and a Sapphire crystal.

Otherwise (5100's being unavailable), I think a modern interpretation of the Flightmaster is a logical first choice. Of course the crystal should be Sapphire, one would have to use Superlumova, I'd issue them with Yellow sub-dial hands suitable for owners of vintage examples to refresh their examples. I'd offer it in several of the more popular dial colors (all black, black and gray, Khaki and Chocolate, and I'd offer a white dial version perhaps with same color subs, black contrasting subs, and perhaps chocolate contrasting subs), I'd also replace the diver's bezel with a 12/24 bezel in a paint scheme similar to the 145.019 Seamaster:

Which makes more sense for a watch named "Flightmaster" geared towards Pilot's and travellers.

I noticed that Georges suggested the 176.004 as his choice. It's a great watch, and I understand his enthusiasm, but it's probably as impractical of a daily wearer if not more impractical than the PloPlof. It looks and wears great on/in the water, near the docks and in Scuba shops otherwise it is like wearing full Scuba gear in a kiddie pool.

What might be a good alternative would be a re-issue of the Seamaster 1000m:

That, I think would sell and it wouldn't canibalize too many sales from the Planet Ocean.

Steve

Good question Steve, what do you all think?